Just wondering if the Accel 8140C can support a direct 12v applied to it? Also, does this look like the Xr-I is recieving 12v constant? It does to me, since the power appears to be from PRE the resister in the diagram. What I'm trying to find out is if I can run a direct 12v source to my coil to power the XR-I. It appears that my resister wire has been removed and Im wondering if I can run a 12v straight from the fuse box or if I need to put a ballast resister in the line.
Ok, talked with Crane about the XR-I... he said to just run a 1.35Ohm resister in the line to the coil and it should be all set. Does this sound right?
That diagram is wrong. If you read the instructions, they tell you in the first few sentences that you need a ballast resistor in line. Later in the instructions, they mention certain coils have internal resistance, and do not need a ballast resistor. Your car should still have the stock resistance wire. What makes you believe it doesn't? The resistance wire is a calibrated length of wire. It runs from the firewall connector to a point where it is joined by a wire that comes from the "R" terminal on the starter solenoid. From there it goes to the positive side of the coil. When the starter is cranking the engine, 12 volts flows from the "R" terminal directly to the coil, bypassing the resistance section of the wire. When the engine starts, and the switch is released into the run position, 12 volts no longer flows from the "R" terminal. 12 volts flows through the firewall connector, through the resistance wire(which drops the voltage), and on to the coil.
Thanks again Larry. Yesterday I couldn't seem to find any pink wire or cloth covered wire as I guess is typical of the resistor wire anywhere in the harness as far back as the back of the manifold. Is it not in the wiring harness that runs along the manifold? In my other post I stated I found the other end - I was mistaken once I found out that the color of the wire should be pink. The wire I thought was the power was green and it appears to have been cut, also wasn't constantly hot. I'll have to go out and take a photo tomorrow after work so hopefully I can get it figured out. I'm a mechanical idiot, especially with wiring, so I apologize if there are dumb questions asked. If I don't have that wire, can I run a new standard wire with a ballast resister inline? I've searched all over the site here and have learned bits and pieces of information, but nothing that I could quite get to sink in.
Eric, I wouldn't try to find the resistance wire. Just do the test with the voltmeter. Coil + to ground. With the points closed, ignition switch on, engine not running, the voltage should read 5-5.5 volts. If you see this voltage, you have an inline resistance wire. If you find that you don't, yes you can run a ballast resistor inline to the coil.
Hey Larry, thats what I did yesterday and when I was getting readings of 0 I took a look at the wire on the + terminal and it was shrink wrapped and a couple of different wires put together, but it was only about 3" long and then it ended with some old electrical tape. So its not connected to anything. The wires on the - side of the coil are attached, just nothing on the + side, which would explain why the car wouldn't start. Not sure what happened to them, but it explains why the car was running poorly at the end of last summer ( I imagine the wires were barely together at that point ). Hence why I Was wondering if I could run a 12v wire direct from the IGN+ part of the fuse box as you would with an HEI, but since I can't, and I cant find the "other" end of the broken connection to solder and reconnect them, I'm not 100% sure what to do. Thanks for your help, as always.
OK, this is what you do. Run a wire from the fuse block(make sure it is key on 12 volts) to the + side of the coil. Splice the ballast resistor into that wire. Then run a separate wire from the "R" terminal of the starter solenoid to the + side of the coil. When you crank the motor, you'll get 12 volts to the coil. When the engine starts and you let go of the key, voltage will flow through your fuseblock wire, ballast resistor, and on to the coil.
Thats exactly what I needed :TU: If we ever end up at the same event, I've gotta buy you a drink of your choice and some food :TU: What rating ballast resister should I use? I may be able to dig up the old thread on here about it, but just incase...
Perfect, Thanks :TU: Edit: Just incase anyone else thats like me and isn't very competant in this field needs help with this, looks like the part to get is the Napa ICR13 Ignition Coil Resister http://www.napaonline.com/MasterPag...mber=ICR13&Description=Ignition+Coil+Resistor
I'll dig this back up because I finally got things installed. I've got a wire running from my stereo hookup that is 12v with the key in the "on" position. In line, on that wire, is a 1.8Ohm resister (Napa ICR13 http://www.napaonline.com/MasterPag...mber=ICR13&Description=Ignition+Coil+Resistor ) But when I test the wire I'm still getting 12.40 volts at the coil. I figure the resistor must be bad and I'll test resistance tomorrow when its light out. Thats the only thing I can think would cause it to not have a drop in voltage. Now, my question is, should I get any reading with the key in the On position if I touch the red lead to the + side of the coil and the black lead to the - side of the coil? Common sense says yes... my meter says no. Is my coil bad? I'm sort of stumped now. The XR-I install went flawlessly as far as getting it put in and hooked up... but now I dont even want to leave the battery hooked up too long for fear that I'll fry the Xr-i unit. Thanks in advance, Eric
Reading around I found a few places where I-man suggested using the ICR13 to do what I'm trying to do, so that takes away the fact that I was doubting myself on getting the right resistor. I also found this on a tractor forum: http://www.johnnypopper.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=1&t=2087 If that is correct... then what I am seeing is normal and I simply should not let the car sit in the "on" position without running the engine, correct? My concern is that, since I dont have points, it will always run at 12v since there are no points to "close". What am I missing here? I really should just put an HEI in, I just don't have the dough right now.
With no current flowing, you will still get full voltage measured at the resistor. It will take some current flowing to drop any voltage across the reistor.
Well, I got the car running tonight and measured the resistance on the resistor. The resistance on the 1.8 rated resistor came out at 2.2 with no other circutry hooked up. While the car is running even with the resistor I'm still getting 11 and some change at the coil, which I read on that tractor forum that he had the same problem. He had to put a few resistors in the line to get it down to 8v. I drove it tonight and it runs better than ever! My tach doesn't work anymore but I can handle that later, as long as the car is running. Also, the car fires right up even though I havent been able to get under it to hook up the 12v bypass, my guess is because the resistor isn't dropping the voltage as much as it should. The XR-I has an operating voltage range of 6-18v but I fear for my coil (8140C). The rev limiter also works as I had it unintentionally set at 4000 rpm and consistantly around there (by sound) it would "bounce" off of the rev limiter. I upped it to 5000, and it would rev higher than before and do the same. Every time. If I can hook up the XR-I, it must be simple. Thanks for your help. What should I do to drop the voltage even more?
Eric, Measuring voltage at the coil with the engine running is completely meaningless. They tell you that in the Buick Chassis manual. Measure from the coil positive to ground. Turn the ignition on(don't start the engine). With the Crane XR-I, why do you need a resistor. Why do you need to drop the voltage? Can't you run it off 12 volts?
I believe I can run it at a full 12v, but when I spoke with Accel they suggested against running the 8140C coil at a full12v for fear that it would overheat and die. When I turn the key into thhe on position it shows a full 12,.4Volts because there are no "points" to be closed, therefor, no draw on the wire and the ballast resistor cant drop voltage, as Scott said, without some draw on the wire. At least thats how I understand it. The car runs great on a full 12v and the bypass wire doesnt seem to be needed either. What do you think about worrying about the coil?
With the ballast resistor in line, it will drop the voltage. Without points, there is no way to verify that, but a resistor either works or it is open(in which case the engine wouldn't run). I wouldn't worry about it. If you don't have a problem starting the engine in cold weather, you probably don't need the bypass. Running the 8140 coil at 12 volts will overheat it? I guess that explains why my MSD Digital 6 box fried an Accel 8140 in less than 2 hours run time. In my MSD Technical book, MSD says the 8140 is good for the MSD 5, 6, and some 7 series ignition boxes. They put at least 450 volts through the coil :eek2: Personally, I don't like Accel products, they have let me down twice.
Here is what the techs at Mr. Gasket said to me Now, reading it, it seems like he is contradicting himself... I'd imagine that 450volts would probably kill it though :shock:. The accel was on the car, but a coil is cheap insurance, what coil should I use? I have a spare "oil filled" AC Delco one that I picked up some time ago in case of emergency... but I'm sure there are better ones. EDIT: I understand what he is saying now... I guess I didnt state my question all that well Here is the "Knowledge BAse" that he answered my question at. http://go.mrgasket.com/AskTechResults.aspx?BrandID=1&ID=134276
Eric, You asked him if you could run a CONSTANT 12 volts to the coil. That means to me that when you switched off the ignition, the 12 volts would still be there, and if that was the case, the engine would not shut off, right? He told you you need a switched source, and you didn't need the ballast resistor. If the Crane unit works with 6-18 volts, I think you don't need the resistor, but you can leave it inline if the car runs OK. I've been using the MSD 8200 coil for years now. My MSD Digital 6 box puts 535 volts into the primary side of the coil. The Accel coil did not hold up to that.
Yeah, I guess I should've said "a direct, switched, 12v line" instead of a "direct 12v line" in my question. I didn't mention constant but I could certainly see how "direct" could mean "From the battery". Maybe I'll yank the resistor out and see how it runs. I imagine even better. Its kind of funny, actually. I was testing for spark (plug wire with a plug in it against the alternator bracket) when it fired first... didnt even have all 8 cylinders firing. The spark is way brighter and way more strong now. Much nicer blue color than it was with the points, the points it was sort of a yellowish color. I'll grab an MSD 8200 coil just for insurance. I'm going to clean up the wiring today so it will be a good time to test without the resistor inline. Thanks for everyones help :TU: Oh, and Larry, tell Dave thanks for the suggestions on the cap and rotor - the last cap I replaced was cheasy and had aluminum contacts... this one is nice and has brass contacts.
