Recently bought a 65 Riviera GS (with the help of a fellow member). The brakes scare me to death! In any case, I am considering upgrades for the car and haven't been able to find info on (a.) Disc brake conversion or (b.) Dual reservoir system for the existing drum brakes. Any thoughts or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Greg
I gather that the stopping distances are not good? The OE system when working right does just fine I think. The exception is hill/mountain country where fading can come into play. The dual master is another thing and not a bad thing to do for safety. I think most guys order for a '67 Riv dual reservior and then have to change the distribution block and add a line.there's been discussion on that in past, so a site search should help there.
Thanks Dan, It stops but really takes some getting used to. I've tried all the search combinations I could find and can't come up with the one on the dual reservoir conversion. Where would I find the distribution block? Greg
You'll find distribution blocks in junkyards on 67-70 GM cars, even those with disc brakes have the junction block before 71 as they have a separate metering or proportionning valve. I think that newer models have combination valves which are made for disc-drum setups.
I did this conversion ot mine a couple of years ago. You do not need to change distribution blocks. They are a huge pain to get to on the Rivs. I blocked the line to the rear on the block and simply hooked up the line from the master to an adapter and the rear line. The dual masters have a different line size than the original too. Also the lines come off the master on the opposite side of the original. It sounds harder than it is. Also there are two dual masters, a long rod and a short rod. Make sure your new one is the same as the old one. Larry
I did the dual chamber master conversion a few years ago on my Skylark, using a newer drum brake distribution block, it was complicated and took a lot of time to adapt the tubing. BTW, the drum block does not use proportional metering. But, I would like to see some comments on the safety of the shortcut that Larry used.
There's no safety issue. You are simply bypassing the distribution block for the rear line. You are still using two circuits. The front wheels chamber goes to the front and the rear wheels chamber goes to the rear. The junction block is simply a pass thru for the rears from the time when there was a single feed. Plus There is NO room to work on the first gen Riv distribution block. The actual plumbing was tricky to make fit but not that hard. Try that with a newer block and it becomes a nightmare because nothing lines up and the lines are all the wrong size. Larry
The distribution block only serves to illuminate the BRAKE warning light in case of brake failure (on pre-67 cars, this warning light only serves to remind the parking brake is engaged). There is a switch inside that closes if pressure becomes unequal in the front and rear system. If you want, I suppose you can use a tee like the one on the rear axle for the front brakes and plug the rear brake line directly in the master cylinder.
I think you guys are missing my point. Phil, as far as I know on my 64 there is no electrical connection to the distribution block like on the later years. It is just a chunk of machined brass. The plug that I installed on the distribution block is where the line to the rear axle connected. I connected the line to the rear axle with an inline connector to the line from the master for the rear wheels. No need for another tee. The 67 and up distribution blocks are layed out differently than the first gen Riv's and have an electrical connection. I tried to make one work but realized rather quickly that it was going to be very difficult to make it work. Imho, it is very difficult to make a newer style block fit and work as designed in a first gen riv unless the motor is out and you have lots of room to play. The lines to the front brakes end up do not line up well at all and it becomes an adventure in brake line manufacture and make it fit. With my simple instructions you end up with two separate circuits with the least amount fabrication. Larry
What I meant was to use a 3 outlet tee like the one on the rear axle instead of plugging one of the 4 outlets from the car's distribution block. Of course plugging an outlet is probably simpler! I know there is no electrical connector for the BRAKE light on pre-67 cars! But it was the main purpose of the 67 distribution block.
Phil, A tee might work but if I remember right the lines are not at 90 degrees to each other, but closer to 45 degrees. I think on the new distribution block the lines are closer to 90 degree and that was one of the reasons it didn't want to fit easily. On the first gen rivs the distribution block mounts to the lower inside of the frame rail under the firewall and there really isn't room to twist and bend lines to get them to fit right. The other thing is the lines come off the master on the fender side instead of the engine side and getting them to line up is a bit of a trick too. Larry
Thanks fellas..... this is helping a great deal. Some further questions: 1) I assume we are talking about a 1967 master cylinder. If so, will it mate up to the 1965 booster? 2) How do I tell whether I have the short or long rod? I suppose I could take it apart before I order the parts. 3) I read something about a pressure reserve setup to keep the wheel cylinders from leaking. If I go to a direct hookup on the rear circut, is there any problem with leakage? 4) Seems as though this only adds reliability/safety but overall brake performance will be unchanged from stock. I think the booster is bad on my car ( I hear a hiss when braking and don't have enough power to lock the weels up) and so I will be replacing the booster and probably the brake lines at the same time. Does anyone have any experience with a disc brake conversion? Thanks so much for your help. Greg
1967 booster/master cylinder combos are available from NAPA. Seems like that may be the easy way to go (hopefully I can't screw that up!). Which is more correct, plated or black? I'll be talking to NAPA tomorrow to make sure the bolt pattern is the same. Will let you know what I find out. Greg
In 1967, Bendix boosters were black, Moraine boosters were plated. I don't know why they had two different brands, that's strange. Another strange thing: Full size Buicks and Rivs with drum brakes could have either a Bendix or a Moraine booster and master cylinder as they were installed randomly during the production but cars with Bendix disc brakes couldn't have the matching brand Bendix booster and master cylinder, they all had Moraine master cylinders (special model for disc brakes) and Moraine boosters (the same as the one for 4 wheel drum brakes).
Having trouble getting the #%*^! booster out of the car! Got the four bolts loose but can't get it off the pedal. Any shortcuts there? The car has cruise control and other stuff attached to the pedal and it is extremely difficult to get to the bolt at the top of the pedal. My head hurts from hanging upside down! Thanks, Greg
I never worked on a 65 Riv but I don't think you have to remove the bolt at the top of the brake pedal to remove the booster. Can't you just remove the rod that comes from the booster from the pin on the brake pedal? When I installed the Electro-Cruise in my 65 Wildcat and 67 Riv, I had to change the brake pedals and this wasn't very easy! It was worse on the 67 as the firewall shape didn't leave too much space to remove the bolt. The worst thing was to install the cruise control brake switch on the 67! It was much easier on the Wildcat.
